New account but I’ve been using burner accounts and lurking since the sub got banned. I’ve been seeing all the standard liberal brainworms again for the first time since reddit-logo and everytime it’s an account from another federation. I was tepidly against federation at first but this has been entertaining, like the old days of pigpoop people who wandered into the sub.

I gotta imagine this will only last another week before everyone defederates us, but let’s enjoy it for now.

  • axont [she/her, comrade/them]@hexbear.netEnglish
    0·
    2 years ago

    i mean this in the nicest way possible and I mean that it’s charming

    a lot of these other instances feel like just kinda charming friendly middle aged people talking on Facebook. It’s kind of whiplash because I’ve been so used to the owl piss and pig shit style of posting we’ve cultivated and these folk are just pleased as punch with their spongebob and tom&jerry memes

  • Azzu@lemm.eeEnglish
    0·
    2 years ago

    I hope it’s fine that I, as an external, come into your space and give my opinion here, this seems as good a thread as any.

    I think what is is the general hostility here. I think I agree with a lot of the political opinions here, however this place seems to revere “dunking” on people. Sure, these people you’re dunking on might not be intelligent, and sure, they might, with their (wilful) ignorance contribute to the destruction of our planet, but I just hate the hostility, open insults, etc. I think it accomplishes nothing except pushing people away, it’s not changing anyone’s minds.

    Whatever good discussion may be found here, I just don’t like to deal with the tone it’s had in. I understand that it’s probably some kind of coping mechanism to deal with this shitty situation we’re all in, but I have different ways to cope and don’t want this big pile of negativity.

    Anyway, I wish everyone a nice poop.

    • MerryChristmas [any]@hexbear.netEnglish
      1·
      2 years ago

      That’s fair, but the thing is… the strategy sort of worked for us the first time around. It worked so well that we got kicked off of Reddit despite being one of the largest and fastest growing communities, and we owe that growth to good old fashioned cyberbullying.

      The important thing to remember is that nobody on hexbear punches down. If you come in with a bunch of dumbass takes then you’re going to get dunked on, but nobody is going to misgender you or call you an autist as an insult while they do it. Most people who get called out on here deserve it, and if not, you can bet I’ll be making an ass out of myself by defending that person until they inevitably say something that makes me regret it.

    • GarbageShoot [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
      1·
      2 years ago

      I hope it’s fine that I, as an external, come into your space and give my opinion here, this seems as good a thread as any

      Sure! We could hardly demand other people stay out, just follow the rules for our instance and comms like you would for any other.

      Whatever good discussion may be found here, I just don’t like to deal with the tone it’s had in.

      This is fair, but others feel differently. I’ll be nice to people who don’t call me a bot for engaging in good faith but disagreeing.

    • silent_water [she/her]@hexbear.netEnglish
      1·
      2 years ago
      1. we don’t owe anyone long, detailed explanations of why they’re wrong. that info is available from any of hundreds or thousands of different sources, including in published books. if someone comes in and asks a question in good faith, they’ll get a reading list. if someone just comes in and drops their opinion, though, we have no obligation to respect that.
      2. all of us, at different times, do give those long explanations. they’re just exhausting to type up. no one can demand our time and energy. online debates don’t change opinions. real explanations of the topics that get dunked on here require entire books to unpack the arguments and properly dismantle them. there’s no shortcut for doing the homework and we’re not going to pretend that there is.
      3. many of the opinions that get dunked on are thought terminating cliches that people don’t reason themselves into – they’re repeating random propaganda they’ve imbibed passively. the best response is to make fun of these ideas, to break the notion that they’re somehow inviolate truths, beyond questioning. that dunking led many people on the old sub – people who wandered much as these new folks are, with opinions that vastly differ from our own – to eventually do some reading and change their own minds. we can’t change anyone’s mind. they have to be open to having their minds changed and embark on that process in their own way, at their own pace.
      4. civility masks the abject horror of the world we live in. civility is the false peace – it’s a peace marked by masking of tension rather than any resolution of it. our world is not peaceful – it merely pretends to be so by demanding those harmed mask their grievances. many of us here are from minority groups – our grievances will be heard and no amount of tone policing is going to chnage that.
      • JuneFall [none/use name]@hexbear.netEnglish
        1·
        2 years ago

        civility masks the abject horror of the world we live in. civility is the false peace – it’s a peace marked by masking of tension rather than any resolution of it. our world is not peaceful

        Real mlk-yes energy.

        but the white moderate who is more devoted to “order” than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says “I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can’t agree with your methods of direct action;” who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man’s freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a “more convenient season.”

        Shallow understanding from people of goodwill is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection."

    • panopticon [comrade/them]@hexbear.netEnglish
      0·
      2 years ago

      Love the gigantic PPB.

      Just wanted to remark that a lot of us have learned our lesson about trying to put real effort into political discourse with Internet randos. doesn’t matter if you put hours into tracking down all your sources and trying to make your arguments absolutely airtight, if the person on the other end just calls you a CCP shill, or an ignorant idealistic Westerner who didn’t have to experience “real Communism,” or a bot, etc. It just isn’t worth the time to try to have an academic debate if the other person is obtuse, ideologically committed, a teenager basically a child, or posting from Langley (lol). Edit: unless you really can spare the time, obviously

      Also, I think hexbears do a decent job of providing sources on average, you can’t force someone to read/listen to them and engage with them in good faith, though. You know that thing about horses.

      Well, happy poops to you too!

      Edit: that was unfair to teenagers

      • YaaAsantewaa [love/loves, comrade/them]@hexbear.netEnglish
        1·
        2 years ago

        Learned that quickly on lemmy.world

        Made a long argument, typed it all out, provided multiple sources, and I just got called a troll and then the mod removed my comment

        The irony though is my sources were all western sources too. I guess they just don’t like real independent journalism

        • Awoo [she/her]@hexbear.netEnglish
          2·
          2 years ago

          I firmly believe GamerGate only happened because things like ShitRedditSays and bullying culture raised the emotional intensity of discourse, which of course caused wilder swings in the other direction.

          Holy fucking shit you’re blaming SRS for Gamergate are you out of your fucking mind? It was an intentional fascist op.

          And how the fuck can you act like SRS was ineffective? Reddit was a reactionary shithole (more so than today) back then. Gamers said “HAHA I RAPED YOU”, redditors all said there were no women on the internet and quoted the rules that rule 34 comes from unironically. r/jailbait was defended by them as freespeech and Violentacrez was “thrown under a bus” by the admins, according to redditors at that time. Do you remember what being trans on reddit was like back then? Any idea? Because I do. EVERYWHERE on reddit was like r/conservative is today. All the liberals were exactly like that. Utterly hostile to trans people.

          Judging by how much has changed the methods utilised by the left on reddit (by which I mean us) were VERY effective at changing all of these things. And it was achieved by being radical, not kowtowing to that shit. By creating different cultural spaces and taking an utterly hostile stance to them.

          The problem with liberals with closed minds is that you have to make them uncomfortable first before they’ll open them. Only after they’ve had some really negative experiences do they eventually prefer to have a positive one and open up to actually engaging in good faith. Then they actually fucking learn something. Until you kick that door down all your sugar instead of vinegar is meaningless.

                • Awoo [she/her]@hexbear.netEnglish
                  3·
                  2 years ago

                  Nah man. You’re doing what the white moderates did to the civil rights activists, and you’re doing what the liberals did to the lgbt activists.

                  You’re claiming that we’d be more effective if we toned it down, dialed it back a bit, only pursued things in a lukewarm way.

                  You are devoted more to order instead of justice.

                  The best approach is the one that works, the one that motivates a movement, the one that creates something. That’s what we did, and I regret absolutely none of it. You should absolutely read MLK’s letter from a birmingham jail, it’s quite relevant here.

                  You won’t like this comparison, but I say it is extremely apt to compare you to the white moderate, people who are sympathetic in the abstract but judgmental of the tactics deployed in actual campaigns.

        • GarbageShoot [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
          2·
          2 years ago

          Many people who jumped on board with GG originally weren’t people trying to harass women, they were people upset with all the condescension and derision they got from what were labelled “SJWs”.

          This is revisionist as fuck. Just like modern complaints about “woke” and “cancel culture”, most of people’s feeling about these things being real come from reactionaries telling them that it’s omnipresent and seeing a handful of exceptional cases. GG has a recorded history of being an impressively-orchestrated 4chan (etc) op, maybe the most successful that they ever had.

  • invo_rt [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
    0·
    2 years ago

    I hate it here now, ngl. I’ve barely used the site since the federation. Maybe I’ll get used to it or maybe it’s time to move on.

    manhattan

    • Sphere [he/him, they/them]@hexbear.netEnglish
      1·
      2 years ago

      I blocked the memes comm on lemmy.ml and that did wonders for my experience; blocking certain comms can make a huge difference if you don’t want to go as far as switching to Local but can’t stand shit like garbage-tier Reddit memes.

    • FakeNewsForDogs [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
      1·
      2 years ago

      Move on to where? The offline world? I’m not super online so I am completely unaware of any leftist forums that are remotely similar to prefederation hexbear. I will say there are limits to the entertainment value of having dumbasses wander into our threads, and sometimes the broken sorting mechanism is a bummer, so I get where you’re coming from. Honestly not sure where one would move on to though.

    • silent_water [she/her]@hexbear.netEnglish
      1·
      2 years ago

      avoid the threads with lots of posts? if you sort by local+hot you basically won’t see them. yeah, there’s the occasional lib who wanders in but it’s not like we’ve been free for that over the last three years.

  • WarmSoda@lemm.eeEnglish
    0·
    2 years ago

    You guys are just straight up obsessed about libs. Do you ever think about anything else?

    • WashedAnus [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
      0·
      2 years ago

      You guys are just straight up obsessed about the unquestionably dominant ideology that deeply effects every aspect of your lives. Do you ever think about anything else?

      No, because liberalism has poisoned everything on this planet.

      • Frank [he/him, he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
        1·
        2 years ago

        Everything else is fucking miserable. Every single day there’s macroscale observable evidence of how utterly fucked the climate is. My friends are constantly being harmed in real, tangible ways by the mindless violence of capitalism. I can’t afford to go out and do shit and if I could I’d eventually catch a virus with a pretty good chance of fucking my brain beyond the point of no return.

        I LOVE EARTH IT IS A GREAT PLACE TO LIVE yes-hahaha-yes-l

        The economy is so fucked the pizza places close at like 9pm on the weekends the fuck else is there to do but shitpost?

    • temptest [any]@hexbear.netEnglish
      0·
      2 years ago

      LIBS ARE REAL. ITS NOT AN OBSESSION ITS THE TRUTH. THEY BROADCAST THEIR BELIEVES WORLDWIDE ON LONG BAND RADIO FREQUENCY AND WIRED CONNECTIONS THROUGH YOUR SKULL DAILY[1][2]. THEY DONT WANT YOU TO KNOW THE TRUTH ABOUT THEM THE SKY-FOX MEDIA WANTS US TO THINK THEY ARE A MINORITY THAT DONT MATTER AND THAT THEY ARE FIGHTING AGAINST BUT WE AT HTTPS HEXBEAR.COM[3] HAVE DISCOVERED: THEY LIVE AMONG US ALL! THERE MAY EVEN BE LIBERALS IN YOUR TOWN AS WE SPEAK?!?!

      EVIDENCE SUGGESTS THAT THE LIBS HAVE RULED THE USA (UNITED STATES OF AMERICA) FOR MANY DECADES AND THAT EVEN THE FOUNDING FATHERS WERE ALLEGEDLY LIBS. COINCIDENCE??? IT WAS PLANNED FROM THE VERY START. BUT IT GOES FURTHER.

      THE LIBS EVEN SECRETLY DOMINATE THE RIGHT WING WORLD WIDE[4][5][6] AND HID THIS FACT FROM THEIR FOLLOWERS. BUT THEY ARE BETRAYED BY THEIR CALLS FOR FREEDOM (LIBERTY && LIBRE) AND ECONOMIC LIBERALISM WHICH HAVE BEEN THE CORNERSTONES OF LIBERALISM[7] SINCE ITS BIRTH IN THE ENLIGHTENMENT ERA. THEY HAVE USED THE MASS MEDIA MODEL[8] TO TRICK THE MAINSTREAM PROPA-CULTURE INTO BELIEVING THE LIBERALS ARE MERELY THE IMPOTENT PASSIVE LEFT HALF[9] OF THE MAINSTREAM POP CULTURE AND NOT ENCOMPASSING ALL THREE LARGEST PARTIES OF THE TWO PARTY SYSTEM. ITS A NEO-LIBERAL EMPIRE AND YOURE LIVING IN IT.

      Basically everything I just wrote is undisputed academic fact, despite the stylized phrasing. Liberalism is by far the dominant force and status quo in modern Western societies, it would be absurd not to address its issues when discussing politics.

  • Tankiedesantski [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
    0·
    2 years ago

    I think it’s good that we have new people coming in who question and challenge our collective political opinions. It’s good to explain and defend concepts because it really does aid in understanding. Plus, we don’t want to become an echo chamber.

    • Zuzak [fae/faer, she/her]@hexbear.netEnglish
      0·
      2 years ago

      Tbh I see it kind of opposite. When people come in with uninformed bad arguments we’ve heard 1000 times before, it doesn’t cause me to reevaluate anything, and it just makes me want to unite more with other Hexbears in dunking on them. When there’s fewer of those types, it’s easier to have meaningful discussions and disagreement, without having to worry about giving libs ammo. We haven’t had any struggle sessions and I’ve seen a lot less debate between Hexbears since it started. But I also don’t think that’s a bad thing, we could stand to do a little less infighting.