The choking problem doesn’t come from porn video games, it comes from the intensely exploitative live-action porn industry, which is not in any way comparable to video games or any other type of animated pornography.
We both know that the relevant factor here is that one is extremely popular and the other is more niche.
So are we concluding that games like R— Simulator are good for society?
Edit:
in my experience are played by a roughly 50/50 split of archetypal mentally disabled people who aren’t going out enough to sexually assault anyone (like myself in the past) and queer people.
This might surprise you, but I don’t actually think SV should be inflicted on queer people either, so I don’t see how queer people being the consumer base is remotely relevant if you’re using the term to refer to gay and lesbian people, and it seems like a non-sequitur if you’re talking about trans people. Obviously, I don’t buy into conservative fear-mongering about queer people committing sex crimes all the time, but they do commit sex crimes at all, like straights and cissies do. So why even bring this up? Because the example that I used was of het sex crimes?
Also, a lot of these games are extremely het (like RS) and I don’t even really get what you mean by “archetypal” mentally disabled people. Mentally disabled people do sometimes commit sex crimes, like groups from basically all walks of life.
I somewhat agree, but remember that it can also be nominally from the perspective of the victim and still very bad, like LonaRPG. Playing as a girl and getting off on her being brutalized in an objectified manner is a really common thing, with some games being more subtext and some just being “watch this girl get r—d” simulators.
Hey now, just to be clear, I didn’t play Lona and I don’t play these games in general, I just end up finding out about them because I really like certain types of obscure indie RPGs and in the process of looking for them, I end up finding out about shit like this too.
Absolutely. I mean, I personally think someone who likes the game that I just mentioned is a porn-brained creep, but the fundamental issue when something is distributed that shouldn’t be distributed is pretty much always going to be the distributor and not the recipient. It’s a basic element of Marxist thinking that we should be deliberately cultivating environments that encourage people to be pro-social rather than leaving a bad environment as it is and moralizing regarding the individuals who respond to it in a completely predictable fashion. That kind of atomization and fixation on individual responsibility is how liberals deliberately avoid confronting systemic problems.
If a soul is left in the darkness, sins will be committed. The guilty one is not he who commits the sin, but he who causes the darkness.
– Victor Hugo (via MLK)
I don’t take a view quite this totalizing and obviously here he is mostly talking about deprivation, but I think that materials that encourage misanthropic, chauvinistic, sadistic attitudes and feelings are their own kind of darkness and need to be dealt with accordingly.
Maybe most importantly, though I would still put a little fault on the consumer here if you asked me, fault doesn’t actually matter, what matters is what creates a better world, and here that involves heavily prioritizing cracking down on distribution, rather than attacking the creeps buying it.
My whole point is that I don’t appreciate the creeps who like this sadistic, exploitative sort of stuff, but that whatever complaints I have about them consuming this shit isn’t fractionally as bad or worthwhile to discuss as the problem of it being put up for consumption to begin with.
I think the difference here – once explained – is pretty easy to understand. There’s a huge difference between erotica (etc.) that either recognizes the other as human or just objectifies them in a way that is unconcerned with their view, versus actively reveling in their suffering and subjugation. That’s it.
We both know that the relevant factor here is that one is extremely popular and the other is more niche.
So are we concluding that games like R— Simulator are good for society?
Edit:
This might surprise you, but I don’t actually think SV should be inflicted on queer people either, so I don’t see how queer people being the consumer base is remotely relevant if you’re using the term to refer to gay and lesbian people, and it seems like a non-sequitur if you’re talking about trans people. Obviously, I don’t buy into conservative fear-mongering about queer people committing sex crimes all the time, but they do commit sex crimes at all, like straights and cissies do. So why even bring this up? Because the example that I used was of het sex crimes?
Also, a lot of these games are extremely het (like RS) and I don’t even really get what you mean by “archetypal” mentally disabled people. Mentally disabled people do sometimes commit sex crimes, like groups from basically all walks of life.
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I somewhat agree, but remember that it can also be nominally from the perspective of the victim and still very bad, like LonaRPG. Playing as a girl and getting off on her being brutalized in an objectified manner is a really common thing, with some games being more subtext and some just being “watch this girl get r—d” simulators.
deleted by creator
Hey now, just to be clear, I didn’t play Lona and I don’t play these games in general, I just end up finding out about them because I really like certain types of obscure indie RPGs and in the process of looking for them, I end up finding out about shit like this too.
deleted by creator
Absolutely. I mean, I personally think someone who likes the game that I just mentioned is a porn-brained creep, but the fundamental issue when something is distributed that shouldn’t be distributed is pretty much always going to be the distributor and not the recipient. It’s a basic element of Marxist thinking that we should be deliberately cultivating environments that encourage people to be pro-social rather than leaving a bad environment as it is and moralizing regarding the individuals who respond to it in a completely predictable fashion. That kind of atomization and fixation on individual responsibility is how liberals deliberately avoid confronting systemic problems.
– Victor Hugo (via MLK)
I don’t take a view quite this totalizing and obviously here he is mostly talking about deprivation, but I think that materials that encourage misanthropic, chauvinistic, sadistic attitudes and feelings are their own kind of darkness and need to be dealt with accordingly.
Maybe most importantly, though I would still put a little fault on the consumer here if you asked me, fault doesn’t actually matter, what matters is what creates a better world, and here that involves heavily prioritizing cracking down on distribution, rather than attacking the creeps buying it.
deleted by creator
My whole point is that I don’t appreciate the creeps who like this sadistic, exploitative sort of stuff, but that whatever complaints I have about them consuming this shit isn’t fractionally as bad or worthwhile to discuss as the problem of it being put up for consumption to begin with.
I think the difference here – once explained – is pretty easy to understand. There’s a huge difference between erotica (etc.) that either recognizes the other as human or just objectifies them in a way that is unconcerned with their view, versus actively reveling in their suffering and subjugation. That’s it.